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Thread: Any Entomologists Out There?

  1. #1
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    Any Entomologists Out There?



    I am sure that everyone has not failed to notice those flying clusters that constantly swirl around in the skies above Arcadia Bay. I have always wondered what they really are, but I have never been sure. Their behavioural movement is exactly like a school of fish evading a predator; they all seem to move as if controlled by a single consciousness. Because they are always so far away and very small it is hard for me to properly identify them. They must be a species of insect, but what species are they?

    Does anyone know? I need an entomologist.
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  2. #2
    I just assumed it was supposed to be a massive flock of crows in the distance and due the art style, wasn't clear.

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    Who knows? They do not behave like crows do - more like flying insects.
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  4. #4
    I'm pretty sure these are birds. It can't be any other existing animal (besides bats maybe). These animals are far too big to be insects.

    Just look at the birds in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH-groCeKbE

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    Yes. How strange, they look exactly like that. Thanks for the link.
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  6. #6
    I guess episode 3 was the last time we'll see them. Because they all crashed into the ground. :d

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    Going by what happened in episode three that is more probable than possible. I have been studying those silly things for weeks and all the time I was wondering what the heck they were. I even toyed with the idea that they were something ethereal, or a physical representation of a time fluctuation. The video that TheEmissary supplied the link to looks convincing enough to me so the mystery is done and dusted. It makes me think back to the bird that Max either saved or let die in Joyce's bedroom. That action, we were told, would have future consequences and it makes me wonder if they are related in some way?
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  8. #8
    Hey, you might be right. 0__o

  9. #9
    Super long post. Brew some tea or something.



    I am not entirely convinced those swirly swarms in the sky seen throughout the game are birds instead of insects. I saw this super creepy insect spiral by the diner and my mind went wild. As Max says, this bizarre pattern of spiraling ants is ominous. After poking around a little online I think this is an example of an ant mill. Shout out to the entomologists out there to enlighten us.

    I don't know if those flying clusters that swirl around in the skies above Arcadia Bay are birds or insects. It's a bit unclear to me. All that comes to mind is those insect swarms from Mass Effect 2 . But my curiosity got the best of me and I looked into swarm intelligence.

    For anyone not certain what exactly that is (like me ) here's a definition that's clear as mud: the property of a system whereby the collective behaviours of (unsophisticated) agents interacting locally with their environment cause coherent functional global patterns to emerge (source: http://www.sce.carleton.ca/netmanage/tony/swarm.html). That really helps, yeah?

    After some more poking around I found that swarm intelligence is essentially a process of self-organization by way of a set of basic rules that the group all follows. And so I went further down the rabbit hole and discovered that swarm intelligence can take on 3 forms depending on the rules followed: swarm, torus, or flock/school.

    A swarm forms if individuals both repel and attract one another but don't try to orient themselves to their neighbors. Think of something like a swarm of gnats for example.

    A flock/school forms when individuals orient themselves more strongly with others in the group and begin moving in one shared direction.

    Now what's really interesting to me is a torus. A torus of individuals moving around an empty center can form if they try to orient themselves to their closest neighbor.

    A torus (looks familiar )

    I hadn't ever seen the word torus before and had no idea what it meant so I did some more digging. Turns out it's involved in cosmometry (measuring the world or universe). If you're interested you can check this amazing link out for all the info but if you just want the TL;DR --> "Hurricanes, tornadoes, magnetic fields around planets and stars, and whole galaxies themselves are all toroidal energy systems...This kind of reciprocal exchange is a primary feature of toroidal systems, wherein the individual is informed and influenced by its surrounding environment, and the surrounding environment is informed and influenced by the individual, in a continuous balanced rhythmic interchange." Le, gasp!

    All of these spiral patterns and stuff definitely points me to the tornado vortex from Max's "vision." WHat if it is a swarm of alternate timelines? All converging upon Arcadia Bay? It's not a natural tornado by any means, and all of these spiral symbolism and references seem to be suggesting that MAX has orchestrated the tornado (and what has Max been doing? altering time). But why and how does Max even have the ability to manipulate time in the first place? Game logic? Or something more significant? It's gonna be a loooong wait for next episode.

    Cookie to those who actually read all this.

    I need to sleep.
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  10. #10
    I do think they're bird flocks. These animals are behaving weird because they know there's a storm coming. I recall someone telling me, there's a parrot that exists that comes in handy when mining in dangerous areas. The parrot actually screams before a deadly situation comes near. Don't know if the parrot actually dies and falls down too. Anyone else heard this before?
    Last edited by Alvare; 24th May 2015 at 11:47.

  11. #11
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    I also think these are birds, because insects are way smaller.

    Seeing the birds in the end of episode 3 was pretty much telling you
    "Hey Max, you completely changed the world and the birds are alive but now the whales are dead, so the world is still messed up"

    A clear equivalent to what happened to Chloe. You saved her dad but she got into a car accident (probably) instead.

    The ants on the other hand are another hint for the vortex, not sure if there is a deeper meaning to them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by airetam2342 View Post
    Super long post. Brew some tea or something.



    I am not entirely convinced those swirly swarms in the sky seen throughout the game are birds instead of insects. I saw this super creepy insect spiral by the diner and my mind went wild. As Max says, this bizarre pattern of spiraling ants is ominous. After poking around a little online I think this is an example of an ant mill. Shout out to the entomologists out there to enlighten us.

    I don't know if those flying clusters that swirl around in the skies above Arcadia Bay are birds or insects. It's a bit unclear to me. All that comes to mind is those insect swarms from Mass Effect 2 . But my curiosity got the best of me and I looked into swarm intelligence.

    For anyone not certain what exactly that is (like me ) here's a definition that's clear as mud: the property of a system whereby the collective behaviours of (unsophisticated) agents interacting locally with their environment cause coherent functional global patterns to emerge (source: http://www.sce.carleton.ca/netmanage/tony/swarm.html). That really helps, yeah?

    After some more poking around I found that swarm intelligence is essentially a process of self-organization by way of a set of basic rules that the group all follows. And so I went further down the rabbit hole and discovered that swarm intelligence can take on 3 forms depending on the rules followed: swarm, torus, or flock/school.

    A swarm forms if individuals both repel and attract one another but don't try to orient themselves to their neighbors. Think of something like a swarm of gnats for example.

    A flock/school forms when individuals orient themselves more strongly with others in the group and begin moving in one shared direction.

    Now what's really interesting to me is a torus. A torus of individuals moving around an empty center can form if they try to orient themselves to their closest neighbor.

    A torus (looks familiar )

    I hadn't ever seen the word torus before and had no idea what it meant so I did some more digging. Turns out it's involved in cosmometry (measuring the world or universe). If you're interested you can check this amazing link out for all the info but if you just want the TL;DR --> "Hurricanes, tornadoes, magnetic fields around planets and stars, and whole galaxies themselves are all toroidal energy systems...This kind of reciprocal exchange is a primary feature of toroidal systems, wherein the individual is informed and influenced by its surrounding environment, and the surrounding environment is informed and influenced by the individual, in a continuous balanced rhythmic interchange." Le, gasp!

    All of these spiral patterns and stuff definitely points me to the tornado vortex from Max's "vision." WHat if it is a swarm of alternate timelines? All converging upon Arcadia Bay? It's not a natural tornado by any means, and all of these spiral symbolism and references seem to be suggesting that MAX has orchestrated the tornado (and what has Max been doing? altering time). But why and how does Max even have the ability to manipulate time in the first place? Game logic? Or something more significant? It's gonna be a loooong wait for next episode.

    Cookie to those who actually read all this.

    I need to sleep.
    I read all of it. Can I have my cookie now?

    Very interesting subject and yes, it does have a bearing on events happening in Arcadia Bay but it is very convoluted to say the least. Is it really going to get this deep? Somehow I do not think so because it would alienate its audience - namely us gamers. The solution, as I have mentioned before has got to be simpler so as to achieve a broader understanding which would reach out and touch everyone. People of all ages are now playing this game and not all of them are 'scientifically' awakened in the subject of cosmometry.

    The insects swirling around the dead bird are nothing more than a mystical portent predicting the coming storm. And speaking of birds and insects, I am still not sure what those flying things are. They look like birds. They look like a swarm of insects. The best way to settle it would be to contact Dontnod and ask them what the heck they really are! But then again, they could only tell us if it didn't have anything to do with the mystery.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alvare View Post
    I do think they're bird flocks. These animals are behaving weird because they know there's a storm coming. I recall someone telling me, there's a parrot that exists that comes in handy when mining in dangerous areas. The parrot actually screams before a deadly situation comes near. Don't know if the parrot actually dies and falls down too. Anyone else heard this before?
    Yes, the parrot screams out "pieces of fate!" Sorry about that - couldn't resist it.

    My initial thought from the get go was that they were insects. I am not sure either way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wambo_is_Strange View Post
    I also think these are birds, because insects are way smaller.

    Seeing the birds in the end of episode 3 was pretty much telling you
    "Hey Max, you completely changed the world and the birds are alive but now the whales are dead, so the world is still messed up"

    A clear equivalent to what happened to Chloe. You saved her dad but she got into a car accident (probably) instead.

    The ants on the other hand are another hint for the vortex, not sure if there is a deeper meaning to them.
    But the birds are also dying too! Episode three made us more than aware of that fact.

    And yes. What happened to Chloe in the alternate timeline is a direct replacement and the reason she did not die is simply because it was not her time to do so.
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    I assumed it was a murmuration of common starlings, a type of bird. It's quite a sight to behold. Clever little birds too.


    (click image to enlarge)

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    Yes. . . I am 95% convinced that they are indeed birds but nothing can be taken for granted or assumed when playing this game.
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  17. #17
    @ Alvare I think the bird you're thinking of is the canary in the coal mine.

    @ julietxjules here's a cookie


    I agree that the general consensus is to keep game content less cerebral and to dumb down concepts to allow games to be accessed by a wider audience to prevent alienation. Sorry if my brainwave was really crazy! Maybe it's me that's a bit convoluted . What I was saying was that the swarming patterns of birds (insects?) and the spiraling pattern of ants all led me to guess that the tornado is a swarm also, just one made of timelines. I was linking the two things is all. The structure of the tornado seems like it could be a toroidal swarm which leads me to believe it could represent an actual vortex, a spacetime singularity.

    All of the dying animals is a high sign that things are getting worse. Birds typically symbolize freedom, power, messengers or carriers, transcendence, death, war, wisdom, life and death, and some deities. The birds dying could be a general sign that a metaphorical death is on the way. I don't think dead birds take the place of the beached whales. I just think the beached whales mean that all the bad mojo in Arcadia Bay is escalating severely.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by airetam2342 View Post
    @ Alvare I think the bird you're thinking of is the canary in the coal mine.

    @ julietxjules here's a cookie


    I agree that the general consensus is to keep game content less cerebral and to dumb down concepts to allow games to be accessed by a wider audience to prevent alienation. Sorry if my brainwave was really crazy! Maybe it's me that's a bit convoluted . What I was saying was that the swarming patterns of birds (insects?) and the spiraling pattern of ants all led me to guess that the tornado is a swarm also, just one made of timelines. I was linking the two things is all. The structure of the tornado seems like it could be a toroidal swarm which leads me to believe it could represent an actual vortex, a spacetime singularity.

    All of the dying animals is a high sign that things are getting worse. Birds typically symbolize freedom, power, messengers or carriers, transcendence, death, war, wisdom, life and death, and some deities. The birds dying could be a general sign that a metaphorical death is on the way. I don't think dead birds take the place of the beached whales. I just think the beached whales mean that all the bad mojo in Arcadia Bay is escalating severely.
    Ah! Well one thing's or sure, there are metaphors aplenty is this game so I am in agreement with you there. As for the dead birds - they do have significance. There are three dead birds in a line in the backyard of Chloe's house. It is considered as a sign from a higher power: God, universe, or where ever your faith resides. Now generally speaking, it is a portent which is telling you that a death has, or is about to occur. It does not necessarily mean the death of a person but means a change is about to happen. This change could pertain to life style, a career, a new lover on the horizon, or anything at all really, but the underlying meaning is that something is coming to an end which will herald a new beginning.
    Last edited by julietxjules; 26th May 2015 at 20:00.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by julietxjules View Post
    Going by what happened in episode three that is more probable than possible. I have been studying those silly things for weeks and all the time I was wondering what the heck they were. I even toyed with the idea that they were something ethereal, or a physical representation of a time fluctuation. The video that TheEmissary supplied the link to looks convincing enough to me so the mystery is done and dusted. It makes me think back to the bird that Max either saved or let die in Joyce's bedroom. That action, we were told, would have future consequences and it makes me wonder if they are related in some way?


    that bird that you save in joyce's room, if you save him you get to take a picture of him later at end in the lighthouse area... you may know this already just read your comment

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by airetam2342 View Post
    Super long post. Brew some tea or something.



    I am not entirely convinced those swirly swarms in the sky seen throughout the game are birds instead of insects. I saw this super creepy insect spiral by the diner and my mind went wild. As Max says, this bizarre pattern of spiraling ants is ominous. After poking around a little online I think this is an example of an ant mill. Shout out to the entomologists out there to enlighten us.

    I don't know if those flying clusters that swirl around in the skies above Arcadia Bay are birds or insects. It's a bit unclear to me. All that comes to mind is those insect swarms from Mass Effect 2 . But my curiosity got the best of me and I looked into swarm intelligence.

    For anyone not certain what exactly that is (like me ) here's a definition that's clear as mud: the property of a system whereby the collective behaviours of (unsophisticated) agents interacting locally with their environment cause coherent functional global patterns to emerge (source: http://www.sce.carleton.ca/netmanage/tony/swarm.html). That really helps, yeah?

    After some more poking around I found that swarm intelligence is essentially a process of self-organization by way of a set of basic rules that the group all follows. And so I went further down the rabbit hole and discovered that swarm intelligence can take on 3 forms depending on the rules followed: swarm, torus, or flock/school.

    A swarm forms if individuals both repel and attract one another but don't try to orient themselves to their neighbors. Think of something like a swarm of gnats for example.

    A flock/school forms when individuals orient themselves more strongly with others in the group and begin moving in one shared direction.

    Now what's really interesting to me is a torus. A torus of individuals moving around an empty center can form if they try to orient themselves to their closest neighbor.

    A torus (looks familiar )

    I hadn't ever seen the word torus before and had no idea what it meant so I did some more digging. Turns out it's involved in cosmometry (measuring the world or universe). If you're interested you can check this amazing link out for all the info but if you just want the TL;DR --> "Hurricanes, tornadoes, magnetic fields around planets and stars, and whole galaxies themselves are all toroidal energy systems...This kind of reciprocal exchange is a primary feature of toroidal systems, wherein the individual is informed and influenced by its surrounding environment, and the surrounding environment is informed and influenced by the individual, in a continuous balanced rhythmic interchange." Le, gasp!

    All of these spiral patterns and stuff definitely points me to the tornado vortex from Max's "vision." WHat if it is a swarm of alternate timelines? All converging upon Arcadia Bay? It's not a natural tornado by any means, and all of these spiral symbolism and references seem to be suggesting that MAX has orchestrated the tornado (and what has Max been doing? altering time). But why and how does Max even have the ability to manipulate time in the first place? Game logic? Or something more significant? It's gonna be a loooong wait for next episode.

    Cookie to those who actually read all this.

    I need to sleep.


    Sir, you are awesome. i read all of this and it gave me chills, so that vortex is max's doing? by creating all those alternate universes and that last straw was when she altered william's death? wow... max.. if this is true, then she is the one to blame.. but its more than that for me, i think the purpose of her powers could lead us to the answer.. was her powers for a greater purpose? or was it a test? and she failed? .... wow.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercyva20x2 View Post
    that bird that you save in joyce's room, if you save him you get to take a picture of him later at end in the lighthouse area... you may know this already just read your comment
    Yes I know. In fact, that bird was the subject of my very first thread I ever posted here way back when it all started. The curious thing now is, if you did save the bird it also appears in the bathroom in episode three. It is a bluebird.
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  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by julietxjules View Post
    Yes I know. In fact, that bird was the subject of my very first thread I ever posted here way back when it all started. The curious thing now is, if you did save the bird it also appears in the bathroom in episode three. It is a bluebird.
    Well some report that the blue bird photo op. appears even if they didn't save the bird earlier. Might be dev oversight...
    But the bird in ep.3 is different, it's yellow-grey and same species as the dead ones in the lawn...

    Btw, I really like this theory of the storm being a swarm of time ripples, it makes some sense! But in regard of the nature freaks occurring in each episode, the storm would be just one in a series of events that are omens ("ominous"). I can't see how the animals' dying is connected to the time travels... (while snow and eclipse can be directly related to changes in time).

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beramaor View Post
    Well some report that the blue bird photo op. appears even if they didn't save the bird earlier. Might be dev oversight...
    But the bird in ep.3 is different, it's yellow-grey and same species as the dead ones in the lawn
    Well. . .I did not save the bird in my first ever play through but still got the photo at the end. The bird is the same as in episode one - you are confusing it with the bird downstairs which Joyce asks Max to remove. When Max leaves the bedroom before going downstairs (episode three) she can wander into the bathroom. On top of the shower curtain rail there is a blue bird - it is the very same one Max saved back in the first episode - she even comments on it because she recognises it.
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  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by julietxjules View Post
    you are confusing it with the bird downstairs which Joyce asks Max to remove. When Max leaves the bedroom before going downstairs (episode three) she can wander into the bathroom. On top of the shower curtain rail there is a blue bird - it is the very same one Max saved back in the first episode - she even comments on it because she recognises it.
    ah yes indeed forgot about that one sry ^^

  25. #25
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    dead-birds-falling-from-the-sky

    a realistic szenario -> pigeon_paramyxovirus
    or
    swarm panic -> if the swarm starts to fly and is in panic (thunder can panic the swarm), all birds act like one bird
    then it is possible that the birds fly against a wall, mail, trees .... (this happened in USA). (1 bird dies, all birds following)

    or
    something strange ^^

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