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Thread: Undead disagreement SOLVED (in my opinion)!

Undead disagreement SOLVED (in my opinion)!

  1. #1

    Undead disagreement SOLVED (in my opinion)!

    I have the answer, DUHHH...

    A few days ago in a post I remember saying something about "blackjack 2.0"... some of you may remember.

    Anway, why not have a fence like "blackmarket birtha" sell an "enchantment spell" for your blackjack that will upgrade it to "BlackJack 2.0" hehe?

    It doen't even have to be a spell, just let us buy a new blackjack that can "knockout" undead without killing'em, just like you can with humans. For those of us who want to play alittle harder & "up the ante". We can choose to NOT buy any frag type weapons while visiting our fence"

    Everyone will be happy! People like us can then go into a mission with only our blackjack at hand!

  2. #2

  3. #3
    What's that supposed to mean? You don't like that idea? You play like the one in the video running around with your head cut off?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    IMO... this might actually be the worst idea so far. The statue-killer blackjack in TDS was an awful feature because it made the hardest enemy in the game completely worthless. Dealing with undead has to be based on careful conservation of special equipment that should only be used in few carefully selected situations.

    This issue is exactly the reason why games like Silent Hill are not scary to me. The problem is that you can kill your enemies. Hiding from- and running for your life from monsters is far more exciting than just blowing them to bits.

  5. #5
    So if you don't want the upgrade, don't buy the upgrade... it's that simple.

    Instead you can buy your bombs & go into the level with your frags & play quake...

    I'd rather have to be sneaky, isn't that's what hiding in the shadows is supposed to be about?

    (scary has nothing to do with it)

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity
    IMO... this might actually be the worst idea so far.
    Yes.

    One thing leads to another. Next thing you know, we'll have Keeper Cloak of Protection +2 or Gauntlets of Taffer Strength added into the game.

    Best leave the enchantments and spells to D&D and other RPGs. Sorry, Greg.

    @Namdrol: Hilarious.
    Is back from the Shadows.

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by PlumsieTaker
    Yes.

    One thing leads to another. Next thing you know, we'll have Keeper Cloak of Protection +2 or Gauntlets of Taffer Strength added into the game.

    Best leave the enchantments and spells to D&D and other RPGs. Sorry, Greg.

    @Namdrol: Hilarious.
    I disagree...

    It's doesn't have to be called "spell", just give me a blackjack that can knockout undead...

    "Fire arrows" are from D&D type games, right? So you can't hold that thought against this idea, hehe...

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    1,701
    and what is wrong with just using constantines sword on undead

  9. #9
    I don't understand why you guys want to go in with all your frags and play like this? Guys.. that's what all games do, what's sneaky about that?

    We've done that since first person shooters were invented, it's getting old..

    EDIT

    It's gotten old...


  10. #10
    A personal attack via a picture this early into the debate? I'm a little surprised..

    Garrett is already over powered enough as it is. He doesn't need a new blackjack that can KO undead. And think about it... they're undead.. how the heck can they be knocked unconscious??
    Is back from the Shadows.

  11. #11
    Originally Posted by PlumsieTaker
    A personal attack via a picture this early into the debate? I'm a little surprised..

    Garrett is already over powered enough as it is. He doesn't need a new blackjack that can KO undead. And think about it... they're undead.. how the heck can they be knocked unconscious??
    Think about what you're saying... "they're undead"... but a flash of light can kill them? That's just as crazy isn't it?

    If you don't want to buy/use the blackjack, don't buy/use it... go in with your frags like in that video in the other post. That way you don't have to be sneaky...

  12. #12
    Join Date
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    Why do you guys want to go in with all your frags? Guys.. go play quake... what's sneaky about that?

    We've done that since first person shooters were invented, it's getting old..
    You're the one with "the frags". Thief is about sneaking, not about going on a blackjack rampage and getting rid of all the enemies in the entire level just so that you can explore the level without having to keep quiet and lay low.

    The undead are the kind of enemy that you just can't get rid of when you want, if you don't have the resources to do so. It's supposed to be that way so that all the enemies wouldn't be the same.

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    If you don't want to buy/use the blackjack, don't buy/use it... go in with your frags like in that video in the other post. That way you don't have to be sneaky...
    Uhh... what?

    Where have I ever said anything about going in swords blazing in Thief? That's one thing I DETEST to the max.
    "If I don't like.. don't buy it" is besides the point. It's about ruining the game putting something in that's so whimsical and stupid.

    And I'm not making any sense? You're the one that's totally hypocritical in nearly every thread you post in.
    Is back from the Shadows.

  14. #14
    Originally Posted by PlumsieTaker
    Uhh... what?

    Where have I ever said anything about going in swords blazing in Thief? That's one thing I DETEST to the max.
    "If I don't like.. don't buy it" is besides the point. It's about ruining the game putting something in that's so whimsical and stupid.

    And I'm not making any sense? You're the one that's totally hypocritical in nearly every thread you post in.
    HUH? DUDE! You're not reading very well! I'm suggesting a blackjack that can knock out undead from behind...

    You claim that you "detest running into the level with your sword blazing?" ISN'T THAT EXACTLY WHAT I'M SUGGESTING! If people like me want to make it alittle harder, we can have the option to go into the level with only a blackjack. If you dont' want the goofy blackjack, don't buy it from the guy who's selling it...

    If you want to go into a level with your "sword blazing" you're more than welcome to do so...

    Read all my posts from the day I joined dude, I've been saying this from the beginning, I'm far from being "hypocritical"...

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    HUH? DUDE! You're not reading very well! I'm suggesting a blackjack that can knock out undead from behind...

    I never said the word "sword" in any of my posts? You say you "detest running into the level with your sword blazing?" ISN'T THAT EXACTLY WHAT I'M SUGGESTING! If people like me want to make it alittle harder, we can have the option to go into the level with only a blackjack. If you dont' want the goofy blackjack, don't buy it from the guy who's selling it...

    If you want to go into a level with your "sword blazing" you're more than welcome to do so...

    Read all my posts from the day I joined dude, I've been saying this from the beginning, so get the idea of me being "hypocritical" out of your thoughts...
    Sigh, you didn't even pick up on that one did you?
    Let me lighten it up for you. You kept on saying over and over about Quake..
    "Why do you guys want to go in with all your frags? Guys.. go play quake... what's sneaky about that?".
    Ever heard of the saying "All guns blazing"? I changed it to "All swords blazing" to fit Thief.. because after all, we're talking about Thief, right?

    "If people like me want to make it alittle harder"

    I'm sorry, an upgraded blackjack that can now KO the only things that couldn't be KO'd.. how is that making it easier....

    Anyway, I'm going to bed. I hope a mod nukes this pathetic thread before it gets even more out of hand.
    Is back from the Shadows.

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by PlumsieTaker
    I'm sorry, an upgraded blackjack that can now KO the only things that couldn't be KO'd.. how is that making it easier....
    It's not making it easier, it's making it HARDER!

    THAT'S THE GOAL! ... ... HELLO!... ...

  17. #17
    Yes, that's what I meant, I didn't pick up on my mistake. Why is it making it harder when you can KO everything on the level?

    And I didn't pick up on one little mistake in my post because it's 10 past 1 in the morning and I've just come off a 12 hour shift.
    Is back from the Shadows.

  18. #18
    Nice recovery... hehe

    It's making it harder because...

    I can leave the frags out if I want... I don't have to carry flashbombs, firearrows, etc...

    That will force me to sneak up behind EVERYTHING human or not human, plus hide the body in a dark corner.

    It's harder to sneak up behind something and knock it out. Shooting a simple firearrow or flashbomb is WAY TOO EASY! People tent to "run around like a chicken with their head cut off" flashbombing everything & not even hiding in the shadows...

  19. #19
    It was only in TDS that you could stock up to the max and go on a frag fest.
    In the others, if you wanted to play that way, you had to carefully choose which undead to remove and which to avoid.
    You just didn't have the resources to frag 'em all.

    One of the reasons we're still talking about Thief is it provided many ways to play with a limited set of tools.
    You can use the guards as pin cushions and get in sword fights all over town if that's your bag, or you can ghost, explore, blackjack, Lytha, whatever.

    An upgrade is pretty much like in TDS, where gas arrows were everywhere for the taking.
    Yes, you have a choice to use it or not, but the whole ethos of the game subtly shifts

  20. #20
    You can do that in T3, run around fragging everying... Watch this, he's doing it thru the entire level...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UUp5SQnzbU

    It's only 6 min...

    Now... If I went in there with only a blackjack, I'd be forced to sneak up behind EVERYTHING and knock it out...

    I don't have that option with undead creatures. If my blackjack was able to do so, then I can!

  21. #21
    Originally Posted by Namdrol
    ..It was only in TDS that you could stock up to the max and go on a frag fest...
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    You can do that in T3, run around fragging everying... ..
    And you accuse others of not reading your posts. These posts are sequential.

    (and the edit was punctuation )

    Edit - Wow, ninja mods, don't blame em though.

  22. #22
    Originally Posted by Namdrol
    And you accuse others of not reading your posts. These posts are sequential.

    (and the edit was punctuation )
    Thanks for the info, deleted... I wasn't thinking...

  23. #23
    Yes we must dumb down any and every challenge for the console kiddies. Wouldn't want them to get frustrated cause it might take longer than 5 minutes to clear a level. While we are at it, Garrett needs an enchantment to take out those pesky mech-bots in case they show up. Wouldn't want to waste any water arrows, so we'll just make them blackjackable too. In fact let's just give Garrett a BFG TAZERBLAZER 9000 so he can melt the face off of anything foolish enough to get in his path. And all this in glorious 3rd person! Gaming for the masses is great!

    P.S. I'm gonna check out of this forum for a while. I'll be back when we can actually see some content. Later, you taffers.
    "Where are you, you, taffer?"

  24. #24
    Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity
    You're the one with "the frags". Thief is about sneaking, not about going on a blackjack rampage and getting rid of all the enemies in the entire level just so that you can explore the level without having to keep quiet and lay low.


    Oh, I meant to reply.. sry...

    It's impossible to go on a "blackjack rampage" . With those that need to be blackjacked you can't do it from the front because the awareness goes up making the blackjack basically useless.

    You'll be forced to sneak up from behind & use the shadows.

    Like I said, if you don't want the blackjack than can do this, don't buy it. Buy your frags instead...

    You can choose how you want to play that way.

  25. #25
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    just give me a blackjack that can knockout undead...
    No. The whole point of the undead is that they can't simply be blackjacked away.

    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    I don't understand why you guys want to go in with all your frags and play like this? Guys.. that's what all games do, what's sneaky about that?
    What's sneaky about just blackjacking everything in sight?

    Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity
    Thief is about sneaking, not about going on a blackjack rampage and getting rid of all the enemies in the entire level just so that you can explore the level without having to keep quiet and lay low.
    That's fun, too, though. Sometimes I ghost and sometimes I do the above. That's one of the many things that make the Thief games great - the different approaches to completing levels. I wish it was possible to eliminate all of the enemies in Sabotage at Soulforge and explore the entire level. It's almost possible, but not quite.

    Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity
    The undead are the kind of enemy that you just can't get rid of when you want, if you don't have the resources to do so. It's supposed to be that way so that all the enemies wouldn't be the same.
    Yes. Exactly.

    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    If people like me want to make it alittle harder, we can have the option to go into the level with only a blackjack.
    Making zombies blackjackable ISN'T MAKING IT HARDER. It's making it easier. A lot easier.

    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    It's harder to sneak up behind something and knock it out. Shooting a simple firearrow or flashbomb is WAY TOO EASY!
    Fire arrows and flash bombs are in limited supply. You can't get rid of all the zombies like that. You're telling us to just not buy your silly zombie blackjack, well, we're telling you to just not buy/use fire arrows and flash bombs if you don't like them. Just use your trusty blackjack. Doesn't work on zombies? Well, that's just tough, because that's the whole point. I guess you're going to have to sneak around them. That's kind of the whole point of the game. I now realize why you're going on and on (and on) about this. You're the kind of player who wants to be able to blackjack everything. Well, there are levels where you can do that if you wish. Just not the levels with undead. I think it's ridiculous that you want to make every single level a blackjack-fest.

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